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Transcript: Sen. Chris Van Hollen on “Face the Nation,” May 12, 2024

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The following is a transcript of an interview with Sen. Chris Van Hollen, Democrat of Maryland, that aired on May 12, 2024.


MARGARET BRENNAN: And we go now to Maryland Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen. Senator, the White House is continuing to send weapons to Israel. But as you’ve heard the Secretary of State say they’re narrowly tailoring this to withhold specific kinds of munitions. Does this policy and the administration’s explanation of it make sense to you?

SEN. CHRIS VAN HOLLEN: Margaret, it’s good to be with you and Happy Mother’s Day. And let me just say that, you know, Senator Cotton totally misrepresented the position of President Biden and the Biden administration. So I think the President is absolutely right to withhold these big, big bombs that could be used in Rafah. Remember, the president of the United States warned Prime Minister Netanyahu repeatedly that if there was an all out invasion in Rafah that the United States would make policy changes and Prime Minister Netanyahu has repeatedly ignored the President of the United States, ignored the President’s efforts to try to reduce civilian casualties, ignored our efforts to try to get more humanitarian assistance into Gaza and ignored the priority of trying to bring back the hostages. So yes, I support the President’s actions here. I thought that were very important to take. 

MARGARET BRENNAN: You though, were part of this national security memorandum that we talked about with the Secretary, you help tailor it and you said after it came out, that the expertise and analysis of the State Department has been swept aside to facilitate a predetermined policy outcome based on political convenience. Are you saying that Secretary- the Secretary of State’s inability to conclude anything in this report is a political choice, not based on fact?

SEN. VAN HOLLEN: Well, I believe the facts and the law show what a lot of independent groups that the administration often relies on shows. So Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, Oxfam, an independent task force that was established to review the facts and the law, all concluded that you look at some of these incidents these clearly were violations of international humanitarian law. So while I appreciate the fact that as Secretary Blinken said, the administration determined that it was reasonable to conclude that violations of international law had- had happened. I think there’s enough on the books to be able to point to specific cases and make specific determinations. And on that score, the administration did duck the hard questions.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, specifically, do you fear that this report helped essentially give political cover to Prime Minister Netanyahu to continue to do what he’s doing?

SEN. VAN HOLLEN: Well, I fear that by not providing an unvarnished accounting of the facts and the law, we have essentially stated that what is happening in Gaza- so for example, with respect to the delivery of humanitarian assistance, and the total restriction of delivery of humanitarian assistance since the beginning of the war, by not calling that out flatly and saying that there have been arbitrary restrictions put on it, I fear that we have set a very, very low bar.  A very low standard for what’s acceptable, and I think that will come back to haunt us. So yes, Margaret, I worry that we didn’t call out very clearly, the fact that those restrictions on humanitarian assistance, which is leading to hundreds of thousands of people on the verge of starvation, over 25 people already starve to death, including kids. I do worry that that has essentially allowed a low bar to go without pointing it out very clearly.

MARGARET BRENNAN: But this week, the former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs Mark Milley said, “before we get self righteous about what Israel is doing”, we shouldn’t forget the US killed a lot of innocent people in Iraq, in Syria. He said the US killed 12,000 Innocent French civilians, bombed Hiroshima, Nagasaki, 69 Japanese cities. What do you make of statements like that? Because Prime Minister Netanyahu says something very similar.

SEN. VAN HOLLEN: Well, Margaret, there’s no doubt that- excuse me, that the United States has not been perfect- far from perfect. But since World War Two, we’ve adopted many more measures to try to restrict civilian harm and we try to improve it all the time. And of course, after World War Two, the world adopted the fourth article of the Geneva Conventions which is designed specifically to protect civilians at war. So, you know, Milley can talk about the things that happened in World War Two, but the world tried to learn some of the lessons after World War Two. 

MARGARET BRENNAN: Okay. We’re gonna take a break and come back and finish this conversation, Senator. 

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) 

MARGARET BRENNAN: And welcome back to Face the Nation. We return now to our conversation with Maryland Senator Chris Van Hollen. Senator, we’ve been talking about the Biden administration. But I want to refer to what’s happening in our own domestic politics right now, related to Gaza. Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said on another network this week that the failed diplomacy of her husband’s administration was a the best missed opportunity for a Palestinian state. She’s said that before. But she said student protesters don’t know very much about the history of the Middle East or, frankly, about history in many areas of the world, including in our own country. What do you make of the characterization and the concerns right now, among so many young voters?

SEN. VAN HOLLEN: Well, I thought, Margaret, that Secretary Clinton’s comments, in that regard, were quite dismissive of students’ concerns about the awful humanitarian crisis and high civilian death toll in Gaza. And I should point out that we should be held to keep two ideas in our head at the same time. One is the right of Americans to peacefully protest, but also the need to make sure that students feel safe on campus. And of course, we also need to make sure that we stamp out antisemitism and hate wherever we see it. But I believe that the great majority of the students are protesting, are following very closely what’s happening in Gaza. They see what’s a very high civilian death toll. And so we can certainly revisit history and past negotiations. But I believe that the overwhelming majority of the students, not all and there are some, there are some very bad elements that are involved, as well as on the counter protests side. But I believe that the students do understand what’s happening in Gaza with respect to the civilian casualties.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Senator Van Hollen, thank you very much for your insight today and your reaction. And we’ll be back with more Face the Nation– 

SEN. VAN HOLLEN: — Thank you, Margaret. 

MARGARET BRENNAN: — and a very special Mother’s Day story.



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U.S. Marines, Japanese and Australian troops will train together amid heightened concerns over China

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U.S. Marines will take part in joint training with Japanese and Australian forces in northern Australia, the three countries’ defense ministers announced Sunday as they expressed concern about a spate of confrontations with China’s increasingly assertive military.

Australia’s acting Prime Minister Richard Marles hosted U.S. Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin and Japanese Defense Minister Nakatani Gen for talks in Darwin, Australia.

The trilateral amphibious training between Australia, Japan and the U.S. Marine rotational force in northern Australia will begin in 2025 with Exercise Talisman Sabre. Australia will also join Exercise Orient Shield in Japan for the first time next year.

“Recognizing the critical role the trilateral partnership plays to uphold regional stability, we commit to trilateral policy coordination and to consult each other on regional security issues and contingencies,” they said in a joint statement.

In their statement, the three defense ministers reiterated “serious concern” about destabilizing actions in the East and South China seas including “dangerous conduct” by the Chinese military against Philippine and other vessels from the region. China claims the South China Sea almost in its entirety.

“We reiterate our strong opposition to any unilateral attempts to change the status quo by force or coercion,” they said, adding that it is “important that all states are free to exercise rights and freedoms consistent with international law.”

The ministers also urged the importance of peace and stability across the Taiwan Strait. China claims self-ruled Taiwan as its own territory and has stepped up military harassment with frequent drills around the island.

Marles, who is also Australia’s defense minister, said following talks with his Japanese counterpart in September that both nations looked to ways to build greater familiarity between their forces. One of the “obvious opportunities” was for Japan to participate in activities during the U.S. Marine rotation in Australia, he said Sunday.

“Having a more forward-leaning opportunity for greater training with Japan and the U.S. together is a really fantastic opportunity,” he said.

Asked if the increased military cooperation would anger Beijing, Marles said the decision was about building “the best relationships possible with like-minded countries, with our friends and with our allies.”



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Photographing the rooms of kids killed in school shootings

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An unmade bed

A library book 12 years overdue

The next day’s outfit

Notes to her future self

Click on the door to enter



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How do you make a portrait of a child who isn’t there? Photographer Lou Bopp found a way, but it wasn’t easy.

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In early 2018, I was deplaning after an 18-hour flight when Steve Hartman called. He had an idea: to photograph the still-intact bedrooms of kids who had been killed in school shootings. 

It’s a headful. And six years later, I still don’t have an “elevator pitch” for the project — but then, I don’t often talk about this project. It is by far the most difficult I have ever worked on.

When Steve, my friend of about 25 years, asked me if I would like to be involved, I said yes without hesitation — even though I didn’t think we would get any families to agree. There is no way that I would have said no to partnering with him on this.

Emotionally, I was not sure how I would get through it. Within a few months I was on my way to Parkland, Florida. Alone. I’m not sure that I realized that I would be on my own. 

But here I was. An on-location commercial photographer who focuses on people and pets to create compelling, honest, textural and connective moments for large brands, per my LinkedIn professional profile, on a project where there is no one to take photos of — for the most brutal of reasons. 

How do you make a portrait of a child who is not there?

In each of these children’s rooms — the most sacred of places for these families — there was the sense that the child had just been there, and was coming right back. It was as if they’d just left their room like that when they went to school in the morning and were returning in the afternoon. 

I wanted to capture that essence.

Most kids’ bedrooms are their very own special places, and these were no different. I looked everywhere, without touching anything. I photographed inside trash cans, under beds, behind desks. Their personalities shone through in the smallest of details — hair ties on a doorknob, a toothpaste tube left uncapped, a ripped ticket for a school event — allowing me to uncover glimpses as to who they were. 

But there was an emotional challenge in addition to that creative one. Over the course of more than six years, we visited with many families around the country. The parents I spoke with seemed grateful that I was there. But each time I received a call or text from Steve about a new family, my heart sank. 

It meant another family had lost a child.

I find it unfathomable that children being killed at school is even an issue. It makes no sense. It’s impossible to process. The night prior to each one of the family visits, I didn’t sleep. And I knew I wouldn’t going into the project. It’s not a self-fulfilling prophecy. It is nerves. And empathy. And sorrow. And fear. 

In my notes from early on in the project, back in 2018, writing in seat 6H on the flight back from Nairobi, I reflected on the emotional task ahead.

“This is going to be one of the most difficult things ever, emotionally, for me, and not just work related. As I read my research documents, I get visibly emotional,” I wrote, noting my gratitude that the dark cabin prevented the other passengers from seeing me.

The prospect brought my own fears to the fore, both for myself — “I can’t help thinking about Rose,” my daughter, “and what if. I’ve lost sleep over envisioning the what-ifs well before Parkland” — and about and for meeting the families in the project: “When I read about April & Phillip and Lori’s plight, I somehow, for some reason put myself in their emotional position even though that is impossible, I have no idea, it’s beyond comprehension, I do not know what they feel. I do not know what I am going to say to them, I’m scared beyond belief. And alone.”

But just days later, I was photographing the first assignment for the project: Alyssa Alhadeff’s room. She was just 14 years old when she walked out of that room to head to Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School. I was shaky meeting the family friend who greeted me at the house. Her daughter was Alyssa’s best friend, and a photo of the two girls was on the table.

According to my notes, “The room was a beautiful teenager’s messy room. My emotions were kept in check the way that they usually are; By hiding behind the camera. I removed my shoes before entering. My heart was pounding and it reverberated through my body and soul, I felt like I was in one of the most sacred and special places on Earth. I was so careful not to touch anything.”

I left feeling ready to explode in sadness and anger.

Later that day, I photographed Carmen Schentrup’s room. Her younger sister had survived the Parkland shooting, but 16-year-old Carmen was killed in her AP Psychology class. Meeting her parents, April and Phillip, was what I was most scared of. 

“I feel so much pain and compassion for them and I don’t want to say the wrong thing, drop cliches etc.,” I wrote at the time. “I spoke to Steve for guidance. He said, just be you. That’s all I can do. Just be me. He was right, those three words helped carry me through this entire project. Just be me.”

April let me in, and I worked quickly, only meeting Phillip as I was leaving. “The conversation felt like we all three were just trying to hold it together. I cannot imagine what they are going through, my heart hurts for them. This was / is such a painful project, and reconciling it will be impossible.

“I think about how anything can happen at any time to any of us. Literally. You never know,” I wrote.

After only about 16 hours on the ground in Florida, I was done with the first portion. I felt the project was a must, but I also dreaded the next call from Steve about the next family. I didn’t know when that call would come — many years later, or the very next day, possibly never. 

But last month, we — and the documentary crew that filmed us working — completed this project. While I haven’t seen it yet, I know Steve’s piece won’t be a typical Steve Hartman segment. How could it be? I know he struggled too, and we both have spent a lot of time processing this. 

I remember one August evening, I was devastated as I left the home of one of the families. Within minutes, I passed an ice cream shop crowded with other families — seemingly carefree, full of joy and laughter. The juxtaposition, mere minutes apart, cracked my soul.

I hope some way, somehow, this project can facilitate change — the only possible positive outcome for this I could comprehend. After the news cycle ends, these families will still be living with an incomprehensible nightmare.



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